Forever Delayed - The Independent Manics Forum

Forever Delayed - The Independent Manics Forum (http://www.foreverdelayed.org.uk/forum/index.php)
-   Manic Street Preachers Discussion (http://www.foreverdelayed.org.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=7)
-   -   The new clues that suggest missing Richey staged his own dissapearance (http://www.foreverdelayed.org.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=62964)

Velocitygirl 09-02-2019 14:58

The source of this Israel story is the local hairdresser who glibly claimed 'he's in a kibbutz, everyone knows that.' I mean, come on. "Everyone" knows that? Really? Who is this "everyone", because his parents, wider family, band and friends clearly did not know that. That alone rules it out as a baseless rumour.

Marat Sar 12-02-2019 15:36

Jesus, what's going on here? :D I'm gonna have to take like 4 hours to read this.

hummingbird 12-02-2019 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marat Sar (Post 2677604)
Jesus, what's going on here? :D I'm gonna have to take like 4 hours to read this.

That's OK ... we'll wait :)

sofarsideways 12-02-2019 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marat Sar (Post 2677604)
Jesus, what's going on here? :D I'm gonna have to take like 4 hours to read this.

SOME SHIT. YOU FULLY ARE.

newartriot 12-02-2019 22:58

I don't know if anyone else has noticed this but when you Google the book it says you can read 32 preview pages of 299 (include images of the pages) but when I click on preview it just leads to a description of the book.

Bryter Layter 13-02-2019 00:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by newartriot (Post 2677609)
I don't know if anyone else has noticed this but when you Google the book it says you can read 32 preview pages of 299 (include images of the pages) but when I click on preview it just leads to a description of the book.

Yep! I noticed that too. I can see a thumbnail of the pages on my phone, but when you click on any of them, it takes you to yet another book description. Itís odd, but everything concerning this book so far is odd. :)

sim 13-02-2019 09:40

Excuse any typos or frequent edits: I'm writing this on my phone.

So, all of this has really been something of a preoccupation. Admittedly, as I'm on sick leave, I have a lot of time to think about it.

There are quite a few background discussions, and so many interesting points and discoveries have surfaced, I'm loathe to let them remain hidden.

This may be a Sofa-style stream of consciousness, probably without the coherence.

Where to start. Well.

The author, SHR, has had many face-to-face interactions with people who were horrified at her manner: the way she launched spectacularly into a tirade against James without any warm up being a major puzzle.

Now, some thoughts on her accusations. I think we may all be aware, as she has oft voiced the same rant, that she believes James acted less than legally in the past. But here's the thing that gives me a good idea of her morals: if she really believes that James was a perpetrator, then she believes the woman was a victim. And if you believe she was a victim, you have to have some respect for her, if no one else, by not airing her trauma.

More on that: I have heard the woman in the rumoured relationship was 18, living alone, working... an adult.

However, I'm more reliably informed that no such relationship occurred at all.

So, the discrepancies here show that it's not something that is morally right to broadcast, and benefits no one but the accuser.

Now, that is (hopefully) not much to do with the book. But there's the fear, the reasonable concern, that this may be in it. SHR's style seems to be more of the passive-aggressive, loosely-phrased persuasion. So I doubt she'll directly talk about it. Too open to libel accusations.

This style of writing, we believe from reviews, is being used to bring the band into disrepute. We have seen the quote (from Rachel? SHR?) about Martin "seeing" Graham Edwards to "ask permission" for the use of JFPL lyrics. This has been worded so as to make the reader question whether there had been coercion on Martin's part.

Permission had already been given, or at least very heavily implied, by Richey in the way he left and addressed the lyrics. Some lyrics fully formed and labelled as songs ("verse" "chorus"), which was a rarity. Martin was asking as courtesy. Not through necessity. But it makes the band sound bad, which is pleasing to Rachel and SHR.

Rachel, need I say it, will not be financially poor. SHR speaks a lot about how Rachel has no one else in the world. I find it hard to believe she has no friends, she's within a church community, but such a statement makes me suspicious.

SHR has asked, a month before the 2019 release date, for Severn Bridge toll tickets. That's... odd? I don't want to speculate, it just seems odd.

There is much context of the Edwards family that is really required to understand the dynamics. There are truths that cannot be said. The band, despite all the ill will from various quarters, have consistently conducted themselves with grace and dignity. Even at cost to their own truth.

The band were family. That's not to say it was a constant love-in. They could tell their truth and look like heroes, but they won't.

Which leads me onto the release of the book.

Knowing that the book will (at the very least) subtly suggest that the band are liars, we have to ask ourselves some big questions. I paraphrase some excellent points that have been shared with me.

If you cannot believe that the band have contrived to deceive everyone about Richey in every single interaction they have ever had, then the book has no merit at all.

If you do believe they act deceptively, why do you call yourself a fan?

I mean, really, why would you call yourself a fan?

Spend money, spend time, supporting liars?

Wanting to buy the book even after you've been told that it contains dubious material because you want to make your own mind up suggests that you believe there's a feasible chance that the band are liars. Again, odd to like and support such men.

I don't think that there's much room for belief here, only evidence.

The evidence is that SHR has a plan, and Rachel is the way to achieve it. Rachel is wracked with guilt (I'm not suggesting she should be). I speak from experience here: it's far easier to grieve if you can pretend everything was perfect.

The band are the perfect scapegoat. I strongly suspect that something's happening in the background - all these delays? How long does it take to write an opinion piece, and for a major publisher to get it out? - but they will not publicly stand up for themselves.

Well, I'm standing up for them.

The book is dangerous trash. Best case scenario is it is so ridiculous that no one believes a word.

These are good men we're willing to hurt because of our own morbid curiosity. They're not perfect, but we must surely find them to be acceptable recipients of our love and respect? Yet we can disown them for entertainment?

We seem to have forgotten Nicky's recent family grief easily enough, seem to have forgotten that they are humans with stress in their lives. Seem to have forgotten that it's actually a miracle that, perish the thought, they're all still here. I don't need to remind anyone of the biggest killer of young men, and I don't think I need to say what needs to be avoided in order to support them.

Even if the band weren't implicated, my own feeling would be to leave Richey in peace.

Enough.

sofarsideways 13-02-2019 10:02

YES SIM :heart:

Bryter Layter 13-02-2019 15:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by sim (Post 2677613)
Wanting to buy the book even after you've been told that it contains dubious material because you want to make your own mind up suggests that you believe there's a feasible chance that the band are liars. Again, odd to like and support such men.

I don't really think that's fair. A lot of us, myself included, pre-ordered the book before we knew for sure whether or not the the band would be slammed and now some of us can't cancel the order. I mean, I suspected it wouldn't be favourable towards the remaining band members because SHR was involved which is why I pre-ordered the cheapest digital copy I could find. Also, I don't think it's unreasonable for fans of Richey's to want to see what his archive entails. Personally, I'm not really impressed by what I've seen so far - a report card from when he was about 12, a school report he wrote about his Christmas with a broken leg and a James Dean quote about living forever that he scribbled on a piece of paper at uni. I know their stated intention is to humanize/reclaim him from the myth which is likely why they're showcasing such mundane stuff, but I can't help but think, would he want the public to see this kind of stuff?

I agree with everything else you've written though. Spot on!

sim 13-02-2019 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryter Layter (Post 2677621)
I don't really think that's fair. A lot of us, myself included, pre-ordered the book before we knew for sure whether or not the the band would be slammed and now some of us can't cancel the order. I mean, I suspected it wouldn't be favourable towards the remaining band members because SHR was involved which is why I pre-ordered the cheapest digital copy I could find. Also, I don't think it's unreasonable for fans of Richey's to want to see what his archive entails. Personally, I'm not really impressed by what I've seen so far - a report card from when he was about 12, a school report he wrote about his Christmas with a broken leg and a James Dean quote about living forever that he scribbled on a piece of paper at uni. I know their stated intention is to humanize/reclaim him from the myth which is likely why they're showcasing such mundane stuff, but I can't help but think, would he want the public to see this kind of stuff?

I agree with everything else you've written though. Spot on!

"Wanting to buy the book even after you've been told that it contains dubious material..."

*Wanting * to buy it is entirely different from your scenario. So many have said they wanted this book to be different. Alas, it is not.

As you say, the question is whether he would have wanted the public to see these things. Given that he had the perfect platform to showcase such items before he left, I can only assume that he did not wish anyone else to see. That's the apparent evidence of it.

I cannot get away from the fact that I feel viewing such things is grossly voyeuristic.

beautifuldistortion 13-02-2019 16:28

My own views are that I'm only interested in stuff that directly links to his time with the band. Admittedly the disappearance is a very compelling story but to my mind he's dead and if he's not then he's a bit of a dick for putting family and friends through all this regardless of whether he was unwell.
He was well enough to do what he did.

Controversial maybe but the more I read about him the less I want to know about his private life and school reports etc are pretty boring to see.

River Boy 13-02-2019 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by newartriot (Post 2677609)
I don't know if anyone else has noticed this but when you Google the book it says you can read 32 preview pages of 299 (include images of the pages) but when I click on preview it just leads to a description of the book.

Lots of self-publishers do things like this, as it enables them to start marketing the book online before it's finished. Less typical with decent publishers, if that's what behind this.

Velocitygirl 13-02-2019 21:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by sim (Post 2677613)
The author, SHR, has had many face-to-face interactions with people who were horrified at her manner: the way she launched spectacularly into a tirade against James without any warm up being a major puzzle.

Hardly surprising, really. SHR crashed into the JDB appreciation thread here and started hurling abuse at him and the fans who love him (and I am very much a JDB woman myself).


As for accusations being thrown at him, Richey was hardly saint in that regard. How can she vilify James for that when Richey was doing the exact same and possibly worse?

raven 13-02-2019 22:18

I took the quote about Martin Hall going to see Richey's dad in a hotel lobby to ask permission to use the lyrics as an implication that it was a mere formality rather than coercion, a quick business meeting. As Richey had left the band the lyrics, had handed them lyrics through the time leading up to his disappearance I didn't understand the cynicism of the book. Richey himself spoke of throwing out whole reams of writings. I think its fair to say what he left he wanted used. Now, how he wanted them used is of course the question and one the band clearly wrestled with but I reckon if Rickey was thinking Pantera meets Screamadelica...he'd have been pleased with Journal:) Martin Hall is a friend too no? But no I didn't read any coercion implied

As for allegations against James.....why even bother to repeat or allude to them here. It's sheer spite on the part of SHR ... similar and equally unsubstantiated rumours have been thrown at Richey and she took them and instead of just dismissing them which is what you do with unsubstantiated bollox threw them at James. It's childish at best, playground level, and as they've no credence they shouldn't be given oxygen, even if its just to repeat so as to damn it, just ignore it and of course that shit can't be published

I don't think anyone's puzzling over why the delays and the taking down of interviews and of links to pages ha

Of course SHR is too close to the family to be objective about the family that's an objective, fair point. Any biographer reliant on a family member for access to personal documents and to certain people risks their objectivity but commenting on Rachel's finances - pure speculation; commenting on how saying she's alone in the world makes you suspicious...come off it. Of what? It's creeping into SHR make it up as I go along territory. And as for being able to grieve if everything about the man seems perfect. The point is you cannot grieve someone who is missing....I suspect anger helps a lot of people deal with situations like this, doesn't mean the anger's always justified or directed in the right way. I wish, not speaking with any personal knowledge of this family, but I wish people could be more open about just how hard it is dealing with someone close with mental health problems, how exhausting, and how angry and alone ....obviously in this case quite literally ....it leaves you and the people around them are often left alone in many ways whilst all the focus is on the individual

And I might as well dig my hole deeper I am still curious to read the book. I'm not going to be brainwashed or disappear into a conspiracy black hole I'm just curious...hell I'll get a second hand copy or try the library....to ease conscience and deny them the quid if that a sale will make them.....look how long this thread is....curiosity is a strong thing:) No one's so far said they've not read one of the interviews or looked back for her posts cos they're likely full of more disrespect than will make it into the book. I'm not sure if there's an implication the 3 remaining band members will off themselves as a consequence of the book in sim's post? C'mon, they'll ignore it like every other book:) I do hope it contains more than school reports though and on the little we know I suspect he didn't have a master plan to disappear even if the idea held strong appeal... I think our mind's can be a prison and there's no easy escape from that...
Having said that I'll be surprised if it is actually published

hummingbird 14-02-2019 00:03

Authors get royalties when their books are borrowed from the library. Not as high as a sale but still income. Something to bear in mind for those wanting to read it.


All times are GMT. The time now is 20:56.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.