To See A Friend In Tears - Jacques Brel info anyone?

[Ampersound]

When i was saying 'faithful', i meant that 'on marche sur les fleurs' becomes 'the pointless flowers can be dispensed with', 'the body wilts before the mind does, surprised to see how soon it goes', when the french text is 'étonné d'être encore debout'. Seeing Momus lyrics as quoted by ditta, i thought less liberties had been taken with the turns of phrases. But i agree, there are many mistakes that might have easily avoided.

[Marcellin Caillou]

So M Noir has a dodgy copy with a dodgy title.

Originally Posted by *lisa simpson*

i'm not so sure it is actually, i think the reflexive part of the verb suggests that the speaker is the one seeing the person. also, "voir un ami pleurer" is all infinitives, so it literally means "to see a friend to cry" - i think it should be "voir un ami en pleurant" which means "to see a friend (in the act of) crying" (i think, my gerunds aren't that hot) which to me makes a lot more sense.

Actually if you use "voir un ami en pleurant" the person doing the pleurer is more likely to be the speaker. The translation of that would be 'to see a friend whilst crying'. Gillyflower has a good example: "attendre un bus en tremblant". This translates as 'to wait for a bus whilst shivering.'

I couldn't give you the grammatical reason for the above I just know it instinctively.

Originally Posted by *lisa simpson*

actually, technically, "in tears" translates as "en larme" so it should be "voir un ami (or une amie!) en larme".

at least that's what i think but i'm not french or indeed very advanced in my french studies so please do correct me if i'm wrong

I think that to translate "voir un ami pleurer" with 'to see a friend in tears' is quite good in that it is not a literal translation but more of a poetic one. Though, of course, 'in tears' is translated by "en larmes" - being of the multiple variety.

[Deets]

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=R0K6N1RV

here are the notes of the original song if anybody wants

[hibernatus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_JJRN_GFd4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uo8fV8exxsg&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWj5M...eature=related

[sinisterimage]

I think direct translations of Brel originals will always be problematic. Mort Schuman famously translated many of Brel's classic songs for his musical 'Jacques Brel is Alive and Well and Living in Paris', and some of these take liberal artistic licence.

For example, my favourite 'Ne Me Quitte Pas' (literally, 'please don't leave me'), was popularised as 'If You Go Away'. The English translation is heartbreaking and beautiful, and although rather different to the original French, has effectively the same intent.

I've always found Brel a fascinating performer who I got into by way of Bowie, by way of Scott Walker, and he literally performed his songs in the most passionate way. To see such fist-pumping fake passion in many artists these days is an insult, really. Whilst Brel was a polished performer, he really knew how to sell a song. When he pleads, with tears running down his face, for someone not to leave him, it's so much more than a 'baby don't go' pop song.

So, of course, when I found out JDB was to record a Brel song, I may have done a little squee.

[helvissa]

Originally Posted by sinisterimage

For example, my favourite 'Ne Me Quitte Pas' (literally, 'please don't leave me'), was popularised as 'If You Go Away'. The English translation is heartbreaking and beautiful, and although rather different to the original French, has effectively the same intent.

"L'ombre de ton chien" just doesn't work as well in English, does it! ;D