JDB's Favourite Pub

[mafiamonroe]

Originally Posted by Littlesue

Pubs should have a 'smoke' room for smokers, banning smoking has helped kill the 'old fashioned' pub trade along with the demise of Industry.

Agree. That and those deals on multipacks of beer/lager from supermarkets.

Originally Posted by Takk

Pubs have gone because beer makes no profit, and businesses need to make money...Food and soft drinks are what makes money, hence the chance to most pubs...although actually i seem to have noticed a lot of pubs turning into indian restaurants.

I don't think the smoking is an issue, people just nip outside.

Yeah but when i did smoke i'd have hated to go outside for smoke. Beer and cigarettes go hand in hand. You drink more so you can smoke more and you smoke more so you can drink more. I hate being near smokers but it never bothered me in pubs. There used to be a really grotty pub in Edward street in Brighton and i loved the smell as i walked past.

[Bathtub]

Originally Posted by Littlesue

No it would'nt, it would be a seperate room with a door, a bit like the snug

Exactly, other European countries have this arrangement without any problem.

[Let_Robinson_Sing]

Originally Posted by Littlesue

Pubs should have a 'smoke' room for smokers, banning smoking has helped kill the 'old fashioned' pub trade along with the demise of Industry.

No I don't agree that it's helped at all. Old fashioned pub trade has been affected thanks to cut price supermarket booze, price of beer increasing and the overall costs of running a pub has gone up to (Sky TV licences, rent and other costs too.)

If someone said to me that they don't go to pubs nowadays for the main reason that they cannot have a smoke whilst drinking, I wouldn't think they weren't telling the truth. If someone abandoned their local boozer because they couldn't smoke it'd be a shitty excuse to do to be honest.

It's not like some pubs don't make provisions for smokers do they? Smoking shelters and heaters etc...

[nocultureicons]

Originally Posted by UEF

Actually scientific studies have shown that overall there was no real change. Vis a vis, pubs that shut after the ban were going to shut anyway.

The 'smoke room for smokers' would end up just like smoking tables in restaurants used to - all the non-smoking friends grin and bear it because the one or two Fagash Lils in the group simply can't go for any length of time without their fags.

Yep, this. Smokers would just stay in the smoking room all night. If you wanted to see your smoker friends you'd need to go in there and there would barely be any point to it as a separate room at all. It'd end up with more people in it than the main room.

[Bathtub]

The other side of the coin is the people who used to say the main reason they didn't go to pubs was because of the smoke. I don't see them filling the public houses.

Of course there are factors other than the smoking ban, but the smoking ban has accelerated the decline of British pubs.

Smokers would just stay in the smoking room all night

In practice, how they are operated in other countries that I have experienced, there are legal limits on the size of these rooms so that's unlikely. I went in one in Estonia that was about the size of a phone box.

[relic]

I went into pubs about once a year before the smoking ban, and under protest. Now I go a couple of times a month.

When I was a teenager, I went to pubs a lot, because that's what you do. I got out of the habit because I didn't have the money to go out drinking more than once every couple of weeks. I eventually stopped going completely precisely because of the smoking, I hated coming home stinking of fags. If the smoking ban had come in back in the eighties, when I was still in the habit of going to the pub, I wouldn't have got out of the habit of meeting up with people there, and pubs wouldn't have lost an entire generation of non-smokers who decided to give up on pubs because of the smell.

Last night I went to a poetry evening in a pub, I bought a couple of soft drinks and some crisps. The pub was packed out with people chatting, having meals, meeting up with friends. I wouldn't have gone to something like that before the smoking ban, no way.

[Bathtub]

Originally Posted by relic

I went into pubs about once a year before the smoking ban, and under protest. Now I go a couple of times a month.

That's great, if more people followed your example then the rate of decline in pubs would probably have stayed around the roughly 1 year post ban 1% mark rather than the 2 year post ban 4% rate of decline.

[Let_Robinson_Sing]

Me and my friends went in to pubs just as much pre ban than post ban. As much as I don't like smoking even if they did bring back smoking in pubs I'd still go in. Mainly because I like the socialising and the beer. Smoking or non-smoking is immaterial I think your average traditional drinker sat in your traditional English boozer wouldn't mind either way as I can imagine he/she values being able to go to the pub and enjoying the atmosphere more than being able to smoke/stand in a smoke free pub.

In the last twelve months we've had 2 pubs close on our high street. Thus we went from 4 pubs down to 2. The two pubs that closed down had a poor choice of beer/lager/cider, had no pool/darts/skittles/crib teams, didn't do food, had dingy interior, weren't part of the local pubwatch scheme thus allowed banned people into their pubs. Ultimately, they had to close.

The two pubs remaining, have better quality and wider choice of drinks, my local has a pool, darts & crib team, they're improving their interior, one of the pubs is slowly reducing the amount of dickheads going in there. The point is that they're doing things to improve their pubs, rather than simply existing like the ones that eventually closed.

I don't think the smoking ban has accelerated pubs decline I reckon it is down to many factors of other things like the ones mentioned above, what about engaging with the local community?? can the pub sponsor a local sports team? do a cheap meal one afternoon for the over 65s and the can come down play dominoes, watch a film etc... Does the pub have a quiz? are there rooms to rent out meeting rooms to local organisations? Do they have local bands playing?

I get the impression some people who go into the pub trade think it's a romantic lifestyle, working behind the bar, chatting with locals and watch the money roll in. It's far from it. It's hard graft and especially nowadays you've got to do more to get the punters.


Here's a thought, bearing in mind the recession and the comparative cost of booze in the supermarket to your average local pub, would the reintroduction of smoking in pubs slow the rate of pub closures?

[Bathtub]

Originally Posted by Let_Robinson_Sing

I don't think the smoking ban has accelerated pubs decline

I think you'd be hard pressed to argue that it hasn't been a significant factor in that decline. Of course there are other, possibly more pressing factors, but it is a factor none the less. This makes for interesting reading, look at table 1:

EDIT: My link doesn't work and I can't get it to.

[Let_Robinson_Sing]

Originally Posted by Bathtub

I think you'd be hard pressed to argue that it hasn't been a significant factor in that decline. Of course there are other, possibly more pressing factors, but it is a factor none the less. This makes for interesting reading, look at table 1:

EDIT: My link doesn't work and I can't get it to.

I'll be interested to see the link if it's back working again soon, I can understand why pubs would increasingly close in times of recession and when there are cheaper and more easily accessible alternatives, people chose to spend less so logic dictates if you're struggling for cash and want a drink, you buy it cheaper and drink at home.

Yet it doesn't make sense see why people would stop going to pubs because they could no longer smoke inside.

[Takk]

Originally Posted by Bathtub

In practice, how they are operated in other countries that I have experienced, there are legal limits on the size of these rooms so that's unlikely. I went in one in Estonia that was about the size of a phone box.

So what's the big difference with just nipping outside?

[Takk]

Originally Posted by Bathtub

I think you'd be hard pressed to argue that it hasn't been a significant factor in that decline. Of course there are other, possibly more pressing factors, but it is a factor none the less. This makes for interesting reading, look at table 1:

EDIT: My link doesn't work and I can't get it to.

Well, if there are stats to support the assertion...some one else earlier mentioned that statistics didn't support that.

I would imagine it's fairly insignficant compared to the supermarkets making beer unprofitable.

[Littlesue]

I would say areas where a lot of Immigrants are living would'nt help the Pub trade either. A lot round by me are Somalians and Eastern Europeans so are mainly Muslims who don't drink and the women are not allowed out in social circles. The pub I worked in till Xmas closed down for this reason.

[Bambi]

Once again The Vulcan is set to be closed down, demolished, and replaced by a car park. It happens to be next to a car park, which is next to another car park.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/cardiff...1466-30485136/

Incidentally I'm going to see a play in there on Wednesday, which is why I've just found out.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/showbiz...1466-30546806/

[The Gutless Wonder]

Nooooooooooooooooooooo! Save The Vulcan!