29/06/2019 Cardiff Castle

[sculptureofabloke]

This was the first Welsh proper Manics gig I've missed since 2011 and it saddens me that I'm not disappointed at all. Grateful to have been able to see the second half of Truth live, particularly I'm Not Working and Be Natural that'd never been played live before this tour and you'd guess wouldn't have ever been played if it hadn't happened...

I just wonder if, after the three anniversary tours and James' Chamber soundtrack, whether they're gonna take any inspiration from that going forward. Alright, after Holy Bible and Everything Must Go tours there's been no Ifwhiteamerica, PCP, Further Away, Interiors.. probably gonna be no Be Natural and I'm Not Working after this either, but I wonder if playing stuff that they've not touched for best part of 20 years or ever has in any way inspired em to play other stuff on tour they've not played before. Just counted off the top of my head 30 album tracks that as far as I'm aware, they've never played live. Not to mention all but about 15 b-sides. Just frustrates me that they've got so much material to choose from, we know what they're capable of but it feels to me like they're treading water at the moment. Or maybe it's me who's treading water, whatever. Course now they're on 13 albums and generally looking at 22-24 song setlists, you're not gonna manage two songs per album even if you were looking for a career spanning set.

[darkanddivine]

Originally Posted by sculptureofabloke

Just frustrates me that they've got so much material to choose from, we know what they're capable of but it feels to me like they're treading water at the moment. Or maybe it's me who's treading water, whatever. Course now they're on 13 albums and generally looking at 22-24 song setlists, you're not gonna manage two songs per album even if you were looking for a career spanning set.

I think this is a debate that cuts both ways.

I totally admire the commitment of fans who do multiple dates for any band. I could never do that, nor would I have the cash to. If I look into my big ol' box of tickets, the pattern I see is that I do 1 date per tour if it becomes obvious that a band only makes minor tweaks to a set. And if a band tends to base consecutive tours on a high percentage of staples (the manics is about 40%) then I'll often just move on to something else. There's nothing wrong with staple tracks, but life's too short to see the same thing 20 odd times with diminishing returns as the band gets that bit older. So on that basis, I would probably only go to final/special MSP shows now.

Having said all of that, I can see the case for the defense on this. The first thing to say, as you have here, is that with 22 songs to select and a range of fans from the casual to the hardcore, it's always going to be tough to keep everyone happy. And it actually turns out the Manics take a pretty good stab at it. If you compare the last 2 proper album tours (ignoring the THB, EMG, & TIMT tours), 60% of the songs were different, which means that (objectively speaking) they kinda do rotate plenty of material. And I can think of plenty of bands who have barely touched their setlist in decade, save for adding the odd new single here and there. So in defense of the band, the impression of stale setlists might more of a product of over familiarity than anything else. And on top of that (and this isn't aimed at you specifically) I really don't get these spiteful critiques of setlists from afar. Slagging off setlists from gigs you weren't at is a bit like reading a book cover 12 times, not buying the book, and then writing a 1 star review about how terrible it is (even though haven't actually read it.) A gig is more than the sum of its parts, and the setlist is just one of those parts.

In my humble opinion, (which doesn't matter since I'm not a paying customer these days) you've always had that 60/40 split in an MSP set. On that basis, it's up to individual fans to decide whether they dig that enough to spend money on multiple gigs, one gig, or none at all. But I do agree that more lesser spotted songs would keep more hardcore fans coming back for more (and doing that more often.) The problem is, if it's the casuals who bring in the cash, then that ratio is unlikely to change. I think the only undroppables should be Tolerate, Design and Motorcycle. That would make up about 15% of a typical length Manics setlist, and it wouldn't be unreasonable to rotate the remaining 85% of songs which gives the band plenty of scope to keep everyone pretty much everyone happy.

[starfucker]

I want Motown Junk and Faster back. Sweet Child O' Mine was good though.

[IntlDebris]

I'm just astonished that people can afford to go to multiple shows on a tour. Where the hell are you people getting all this money from?

[Abstract Unknown Girl]

Originally Posted by IntlDebris

I'm just astonished that people can afford to go to multiple shows on a tour. Where the hell are you people getting all this money from?

People save up in between tours, or treat the tour as their holiday for the year rather than going abroad (we don't go on big summer holidays like lots of others do), or don't go to see many other bands as well etc. I know I'm lucky to have been able to see them so many times over the years and understand others aren't able to or want to. Everyone's life circumstances and hobbies/interests are different...each to their own and all that.

[IntlDebris]

Yeah, it wasn't intended to sound so critical. Sometimes have to remind myself that not everybody has quite as little money as I do haha. For me, gigs are an exceptionally rare thing as the prices are just beyond what I can afford.

[Suicide Aldi]

In the last two years, in addition to Truth ( almost ) in full, which includes many lesser spotted and never before played tracks, we have also had,
Sleepflower
No surface
30 year war
Solitude somtimes is
Slash n burn
Horses under starlight
Let Robeson sing
Walk me to the bridge
Faster (acoustic)
Stay beautiful
4 Ever delayed
There by the grace of god
Show me the wonder
A song for departure
Indian summer
Send away the tigers
Found that soul
The second great depression
This sullen welsh heart
Born to end.
I dont see why people are complaining to be honest. As somone else said, its the casuals who bring in the most money, so it really is a balancing act.

[UEF]

Yeah they haven’t been shy about playing the curios

[Deets]

Originally Posted by Abstract Unknown Girl

People save up in between tours, or treat the tour as their holiday for the year rather than going abroad (we don't go on big summer holidays like lots of others do), or don't go to see many other bands as well etc. I know I'm lucky to have been able to see them so many times over the years and understand others aren't able to or want to. Everyone's life circumstances and hobbies/interests are different...each to their own and all that.

yes, this year I'm having the first proper summer holiday in 4-5 years because the rest of it was tour related.

I'm not going to any festivals either which is why I decided to do 2 extra dates (cambridge and wembley).

[LA ex]

I can see the debate from both sides. On the one hand, with each tour they do change the setlist quite a lot. On the otherhand, whilst on tour they do keep pretty much the same set with only one or two alterations throughout - on the last two pretty much twenty two of the twenty three songs were the same throughout and one changes every few gigs.

I've banged on about it gain so sorry for repeating myself, but how Suede handled their last tour is what I'd love to see the Manics do. Over a twelve night tour every night included the same eight big hits, the same eight tracks off their new album, but then the remaining eight songs were completely changed every night. The casual fans there for the hits were kept happy, the fans who don't want to see them rest on old material were kept happy, and the hardcore fans who went to every night of the tour were kept happy with new additions (ranging from some pretty big singles to rare b sides) every night.

[Manic Street Hippie]

What is Sean’s tattoo on his arm?