Know Your Enemy 20 scheduled for 2021 release

[LA ex]

Originally Posted by Jack

Haha yeah, it doesn't really make sense ("the Avalanches are going to remix SWSS and we'll prefer it to the original"). Unless it was done really early on in the process?

Alternatively, maybe they were running with the 2-albums idea until really late in the day - so all the tracks were finished, remixes done etc but last minute they scrapped it and went with the tracklist we know (and love?)

Someone will have to remind me of the timings and what was said at the time, but was the simultaneous release of So Why So Sad and Found that Soul as singles supposed to be a precursor to two separate albums being released?

[Dancing Kirby]

That tracklist being from 2001 is indeed kinda sus.

The So Why So Sad remix. It wouldn’t be the first time they put a remix on an album and I think it’s the better version but it wouldn’t have been at the expense of the original. They couldn’t have gone on TOTP and CDUK and performed that remix. Come on, let’s be real.

The idea that two songs were intended for the album and then never mentioned again for two decades is hard to believe.

Masses was explicitly released as a standalone single, not for an album released over a year later.

Found That Soul would have always been the opening track of an album called Know Your Enemy. They’ve moved that from its natural position for the sake of being different.

Similarly, if the idea was to release Know Your Enemy as a double album, it wouldn’t have made sense at the time to have Door to the River as disc 1 when it largely sounds like a natural progression from TIMTTMY.

I always assumed the song Door to the River was recorded alongside the Forever Delayed tracks and wouldn’t be surprised if Rosebud was too. The name alone is a perfect way to close a chapter. Better than Happy Ending anyway.

Having the last four tracks from the original album (including the bonus track) on Side A of solidarity is weird. They got that sequencing right the first time. But this is the same Nicky who thought dumping Welcome to the Deadzone at the start of SATT made sense to the flow of the album. He clearly listens to all his music on shuffle. Side B is like an encore, although I suppose less so than Side F of The Clash’s Sandinista.

Ugh. It’s Sunday morning.

[Suicide Aldi]

Originally Posted by Dancing Kirby

That tracklist being from 2001 is indeed kinda sus.

The So Why So Sad remix. It wouldn’t be the first time they put a remix on an album and I think it’s the better version but it wouldn’t have been at the expense of the original. They couldn’t have gone on TOTP and CDUK and performed that remix. Come on, let’s be real.

The idea that two songs were intended for the album and then never mentioned again for two decades is hard to believe.

Masses was explicitly released as a standalone single, not for an album released over a year later.

Found That Soul would have always been the opening track of an album called Know Your Enemy. They’ve moved that from its natural position for the sake of being different.

Similarly, if the idea was to release Know Your Enemy as a double album, it wouldn’t have made sense at the time to have Door to the River as disc 1 when it largely sounds like a natural progression from TIMTTMY.

I always assumed the song Door to the River was recorded alongside the Forever Delayed tracks and wouldn’t be surprised if Rosebud was too. The name alone is a perfect way to close a chapter. Better than Happy Ending anyway.

Having the last four tracks from the original album (including the bonus track) on Side A of solidarity is weird. They got that sequencing right the first time. But this is the same Nicky who thought dumping Welcome to the Deadzone at the start of SATT made sense to the flow of the album. He clearly listens to all his music on shuffle. Side B is like an encore, although I suppose less so than Side F of The Clash’s Sandinista.

Ugh. It’s Sunday morning.

Im pretty sure it was said at the time that the song Dood To The River was a KYE leftover.

[Routine Builder]

It really doesn't sound like it though, could have been a more embryonic version but definitely not in the form that ended up on FD.

[Dancing Kirby]

I confused The Convalescent with Epicentre above but the point would still remain about moving so many tracks over from the second half of an album to the first. That would very rarely work.

Speaking of those two. They’re both shorter now so Marilyn Manson’s ass has almost certainly been removed and I think we can all be grateful for that even without the recent allegations. Epicentre is over a minute shorter and obviously lost its coda and I am much less appreciative of that.

Wattsville Blues is also shorter so it looks like Nicky has grown out of that rant at the end but Miss Europa remains the same length so braindead motherfuckers stays.

[Matt_PhoenixFactor]

Groundhog days looks to be a minute or so longer on the album. My guess is that they moved the happy black days part from epicentre to groundhog days

[Europa Gluten Free]

Originally Posted by Dancing Kirby

I confused The Convalescent with Epicentre above but the point would still remain about moving so many tracks over from the second half of an album to the first. That would very rarely work.

Speaking of those two. They’re both shorter now so Marilyn Manson’s ass has almost certainly been removed and I think we can all be grateful for that even without the recent allegations. Epicentre is over a minute shorter and obviously lost its coda and I am much less appreciative of that.

Wattsville Blues is also shorter so it looks like Nicky has grown out of that rant at the end but Miss Europa remains the same length so braindead motherfuckers stays.

Amazing detective work!

[Son of Stopped]

We can rip the discs and make our own KYE Classic playlist.
Didn't notice the timings going werid. I'm still getting a nice t-shirt out of this.
But we can always make playlists!
I think my biggest obstacle is the 2001 what ifs?
That reminds me, will have to ask pharmacist for an emergency strip as I put prescription in Friday afternoon and it takes two days to process.

[PaulTMA]

Ah jesus, they've edited some songs down but still not lost 'braindead motherfuckers'? God damn it.

Apologies to those who like that bit.

My fantasy KYE: remove Wattsville and Royal, mix out the 'braindead motherfuckers' bit, yeah, go on, get rid of Brian Warner while we're at it. Leave verse 2 of Freedom Of Speech alone even though it's pure cringe. Seriously reduce the compression and limiting. Leave the actual mix alone. Ta da! I'll get me coat.

[FacelessSenseOfVoid]

I hope they've changed Brian Warner to Brian Woolnough because that's what I've been singing for the last 20+ years.

[Routine Builder]

Still hoping that Kevin Shields contribution is turned up to an audible level on Freedom of Speech Won't Feed My Children.

[Marat Sar]

Originally Posted by Dancing Kirby

Having the last four tracks from the original album (including the bonus track) on Side A of solidarity is weird. They got that sequencing right the first time. But this is the same Nicky who thought dumping Welcome to the Deadzone at the start of SATT made sense to the flow of the album. He clearly listens to all his music on shuffle. Side B is like an encore, although I suppose less so than Side F of The Clash’s Sandinista.

Ugh. It’s Sunday morning.

No no! (He argues online like it's 2004) -- those two minor changes on SATT and TIMTTY are just annoying, a genuinely interesting reconceptualization. A new mix for the whole album. SATT and TIMTTY resequencing was just: dude, I wanted a remaster of the albums, the old masters were showing their age. Now I have to edit those 2 songs back in. This is different, it's not supposed to replace the KYE like those were. The original KYE has a pretty nice master, as good as it can be with those contentious mixes. This is an alternate take on the whole thing. And very ambitious at it. With new tracks, a new mix, new art...

I actually hope they do the same -- and more -- for Lifeblood. Nothing on that album can be improved by a remaster anyway, it's pretty much perfect. (To Repel Ghosts is a little narrower in its staging than the rest of the album, but that's a minor quibble for audiophiles only). A complete reimagining that uses the 15 incredibly good extra tracks from that era...

This ambitious revisionism is commendable, creative and original. Few (if any?) bands have ever done that -- few bands are as obsessed with their back catalogue as the Manics. (As they ought to be.)

Here's an absolutely insane idea I've said before: they should build an entire new album out of their Forever Delayed-Lifeblood-SATT era b-side material. Using the stems, JDB's incredible vocals, but adding new production, new backing vocals, more lyrics etc.

Originally Posted by PaulTMA

My fantasy KYE: remove Wattsville and Royal, mix out the 'braindead motherfuckers' bit, yeah, go on, get rid of Brian Warner while we're at it. Leave verse 2 of Freedom Of Speech alone even though it's pure cringe. Seriously reduce the compression and limiting. Leave the actual mix alone. Ta da! I'll get me coat.

It's incredible to me that human beings can have such varied tastes Everyone I know (me included) absolutely adores that braindead motherfuckers moment. It's so oddly melancholic. That transcendent, celestial disco swirl, Nicky sounds both sad and righteous. I guess it's a strong aesthetic and those tend to create strong reactions.

[less than zero]

There’s no way that tracklisting can be from 2001. Including Masses would go against the whole release and delete concept, can’t see they would have then stuck it on an album.

Rosebud is a real treat, JBD’s voice reminds me of Lifeblood b-sides like All Alone Here and Litany. I really miss that yearning in his voice.

[chieftan mews]

Originally Posted by Routine Builder

It really doesn't sound like it though, could have been a more embryonic version but definitely not in the form that ended up on FD.

This is definitely the case. I believe the version in this reissue will basically be guitar, vocals, drums and not much else. I think all the strings and extras have been removed.

[Vancouver]

Find it interesting that by all reports James and Sean didn't give a shit about this (or any??) reissue...it was mostly driven by Wire. Yet James remixed the entire thing? ODD. Hoping he was actively involved and the press release isn't just blowing his involvement out of proportion.