B-sides collection - is it really complete?

[gabo86]

Originally Posted by slop101

Thank you for these lists!

I'm stoked on the few Japanese 2CD deluxe reissues I got that have all the B-sides for each album, but man, I'm still missing a ton of these songs, almost every one from Journal up to now.

I would freaking love a compilation box-set of all of these. Or more deluxe reissues. Though a box set would be preferable to having to rebuy the proper albums.

Likelihood of such a compilation?

We all hope for it, but it would be a compilation and lots of tracks would be missing. So, it's better to look for each one separately, if possible.

[Automatik]

Are the There By The Grace Of God b-sides from the KYE recording sessions?

I'd always suspected it due to their similarity to Door To The River, but never found evidence for it one way or another.

[gabo86]

Originally Posted by Automatik

Are the There By The Grace Of God b-sides from the KYE recording sessions?

I'd always suspected it due to their similarity to Door To The River, but never found evidence for it one way or another.

They shouldn't.
Actually my playlist for the KYE era should be split in two: the first 10 tracks are the KYE B-sides, and from There By The Grace Of God till the end (9 tracks) it's another session, that we can call the "Forever delayed" session. These are mainly electronic songs, more electronic than KYE, more similar to the LB sessions, but anyway still different from them.
But I put the FD b-sides into the KYE because FD it's not a "proper album", and so I couldn't create a "companion album" of an album that doesn't exist.

Anyway, your nickname of course reminds me of one of the There By The Grace Of God. And, I dare, one of my favourite Manics songs.

[Automatik]

Originally Posted by gabo86

They shouldn't.
Actually my playlist for the KYE era should be split in two: the first 10 tracks are the KYE B-sides, and from There By The Grace Of God till the end (9 tracks) it's another session, that we can call the "Forever delayed" session. These are mainly electronic songs, more electronic than KYE, more similar to the LB sessions, but anyway still different from them.

Yes, in all my playlists I have always put Door To The River and 4 Ever Delayed in the same grouping of tracks as There By The Grace Of God and its b-sides.

As I mentioned before on here, I'm fascinated by how KYE dovetails into There By The Grace Of God and thence into Lifeblood and God Save The Manics, both musically and in terms of when TBTGOG and the others were actually recorded. It's all the more curious as Door To The River, which we know is from the KYE sessions, sounds so obviously identical in mood to TBTGOG and 4 Ever Delayed.

Originally Posted by gabo86

But I put the FD b-sides into the KYE because FD it's not a "proper album", and so I couldn't create a "companion album" of an album that doesn't exist.

I understand that and empathise completely. It's frustrating.

Originally Posted by gabo86

Anyway, your nickname of course reminds me of one of the There By The Grace Of God. And, I dare, one of my favourite Manics songs.

Thank you. It's one of my favourites too, means a lot to me for various reasons, and I thought it would be suitably referential and indeed reverential for a username. All of the b-sides in the TBTGOG 'era' are excellent.

[Automatik]

Incidentally, after much thought, I'd put Judge Yrself in THB era, as that is when it is really from, even if it was released much later.

[gabo86]

Originally Posted by Automatik

Yes, in all my playlists I have always put Door To The River and 4 Ever Delayed in the same grouping of tracks as There By The Grace Of God and its b-sides.

As I mentioned before on here, I'm fascinated by how KYE dovetails into There By The Grace Of God and thence into Lifeblood and God Save The Manics, both musically and in terms of when TBTGOG and the others were actually recorded. It's all the more curious as Door To The River, which we know is from the KYE sessions, sounds so obviously identical in mood to TBTGOG and 4 Ever Delayed.



I understand that and empathise completely. It's frustrating.



Thank you. It's one of my favourites too, means a lot to me for various reasons, and I thought it would be suitably referential and indeed reverential for a username. All of the b-sides in the TBTGOG 'era' are excellent.

Is actually Door To The River from the KYE sessions? I didn't know it, and I always thought it was from the FD sessions (ok, it's less electronic than the other tracks, but still). And yes, the progression you wrote about is impressive.

I am glad you empathise with me (unless you wanted to make fun of me ), I had to put those B-sides in the KYE era. And, for the very same reason, the National Treasures b-sides are at the end of the PFYAM playlist-

In Flint's guide to the Manics songs (a must read for everyone here) he states that Automatik Technicolour is a re-write of You Stone The Sun From My Heart, and I can see why, but in my opinion is far better.

[gabo86]

Originally Posted by Automatik

Incidentally, after much thought, I'd put Judge Yrself in THB era, as that is when it is really from, even if it was released much later.

Didn't they re-record it in 2003? I'm not sure about this but I thought so, so I put it there.

[Automatik]

Originally Posted by gabo86

Is actually Door To The River from the KYE sessions? I didn't know it, and I always thought it was from the FD sessions (ok, it's less electronic than the other tracks, but still).

I always thought Door To The River was from the FD sessions too, but I read recently in an old interview with Nicky that it was recorded for KYE but left out because it didn't fit either of the two moods of the album (namely raucous agit-rock on the one hand and West Coast surf 'roll' on the other). Midnight Sun is also from the KYE sessions.

Originally Posted by gabo86

I am glad you empathise with me (unless you wanted to make fun of me )

Not making fun of you, no. It's a delight to meet a fellow b-side obsessive. As I said before, for the most part I listen to the b-sides more than the albums.

Originally Posted by gabo86

In Flint's guide to the Manics songs (a must read for everyone here) he states that Automatik Technicolour is a re-write of You Stone The Sun From My Heart, and I can see why, but in my opinion is far better.

Yes, Flint's guide is a fantastic resource.

Of the TBTGOG era I can never decide if I like Automatik Teknicolour or It's All Gone more, but Automatik Teknicolour usually wins because of various memories I attach to it.

It's All Gone would have fitted nicely on the KYE 'West Coast' album, btw. It sounds like a warm summer night.

[Automatik]

Originally Posted by gabo86

Didn't they re-record it in 2003? I'm not sure about this but I thought so, so I put it there.

I presumed they did. I notice, however, that on the 'official' video on Vevo - I know - there's the following curious small print: '(C) 1994 SONY BMG MUSIC ENTERTAINMENT (UK) Limited' - although this perhaps refers to when the song was written, rather than recorded.

[gabo86]

Originally Posted by Automatik

I always thought Door To The River was from the FD sessions too, but I read recently in an old interview with Nicky that it was recorded for KYE but left out because it didn't fit either of the two moods of the album (namely raucous agit-rock on the one hand and West Coast surf 'roll' on the other). Midnight Sun is also from the KYE sessions.



Not making fun of you, no. It's a delight to meet a fellow b-side obsessive. As I said before, for the most part I listen to the b-sides more than the albums.



Yes, Flint's guide is a fantastic resource.

Of the TBTGOG era I can never decide if I like Automatik Teknicolour or It's All Gone more, but Automatik Teknicolour usually wins because of various memories I attach to it.

It's All Gone would have fitted nicely on the KYE 'West Coast' album, btw. It sounds like a warm summer night.

Originally Posted by Automatik

I presumed they did. I notice, however, that on the 'official' video on Vevo - I know - there's the following curious small print: '(C) 1994 SONY BMG MUSIC ENTERTAINMENT (UK) Limited' - although this perhaps refers to when the song was written, rather than recorded.

It's strange when I read that Door To The River was left out because it didn't fit KYE...we know that KYE was meant to be "two moods", but it ended to be "several moods" (think about Miss Europa Disco Dancer, the un-manic-est song EVER, but still great), so maybe there was room for Door To The River...anyway, great song. And yes, I know that Midnight Sun (another great song) is from the KYE sessions.

Yes, I am a B-side obsessive, and it's rare to find a band with so many great b-sides as the Manics.

For the "battle" between Automatik Teknicolour and It's All Gone, I tend to prefer the first one because of the chorus. Automatik literally "explodes" on a fantastic Manics trademark chorus, while It's All Gone is quieter and more subtle. I don't mind quieter songs, but Automatik, as I said, explodes in my ears and also in my heart.

For Judge Yr'self, I'm quite sure that is known whether the song has been re-recorded in 2003 or not. But I don't know it, so if somebody could shed some light on it we'd be grateful.

[Automatik]

Originally Posted by gabo86

It's strange when I read that Door To The River was left out because it didn't fit KYE...we know that KYE was meant to be "two moods", but it ended to be "several moods" (think about Miss Europa Disco Dancer, the un-manic-est song EVER, but still great), so maybe there was room for Door To The River...anyway, great song. And yes, I know that Midnight Sun (another great song) is from the KYE sessions.

If Door To The River and Midnight Sun were recorded during the KYE sessions and then unused, it raises another question of relevance when considering b-sides and 'exclusive tracks' - how many tracks recorded in each session are left unused?

It took over a decade for Midnight Sun to see the light of day, and nearly a decade for Judge Yrself (admittedly given different circumstances). Are there any other remnant songs from any era that we don't know about?

I think I read JDB mentioning that there nine (!) more unreleased songs from the RTF/Futurology sessions, which sounds far too many.

Originally Posted by gabo86

Yes, I am a B-side obsessive, and it's rare to find a band with so many great b-sides as the Manics.

Agreed. It's like a hidden treasure trove. It's hard to believe some of the tracks that were left off albums (and some that were included). If you haven't heard the band's b-sides, you've only heard half of what the band are.

Originally Posted by gabo86

For the "battle" between Automatik Teknicolour and It's All Gone, I tend to prefer the first one because of the chorus. Automatik literally "explodes" on a fantastic Manics trademark chorus, while It's All Gone is quieter and more subtle. I don't mind quieter songs, but Automatik, as I said, explodes in my ears and also in my heart.

Yep. It's a pity neither of them were on an album, so that more people would actually hear them.

Originally Posted by gabo86

For Judge Yr'self, I'm quite sure that is known whether the song has been re-recorded in 2003 or not. But I don't know it, so if somebody could shed some light on it we'd be grateful.

Absolutely. I'd be very interested if anyone could clear this up for us.

[Marconi Delorian]

James mentioned incorporating some of Sean's techno remix of Judge Yr'self in to the 2003 version, not sure if this meant re-arranging and re-recording or literally adding it to an original. Pretty sure at least the vocals were recorded especially for the new version.

[Automatik]

Originally Posted by Marconi Delorian

Pretty sure at least the vocals were recorded especially for the new version.

I've always felt that Judge Yrself sounds 'newer' production-wise than THB or its associated tracks, but that could just because it was recorded after THB. It could, of course, also be due to it being (partly?) re-recorded.

The Wikipedia article for Lipstick Traces, which I suspect was written by someone on here (and so I take it to be more reliable than Wikipedia generally is), states that Judge Yrself was recorded in 1995.

I don't have my copy of Lipstick Traces to hand (I ripped it long ago) - what does it say on the liner notes about who recorded and produced Judge Yrself? Was it Alex Silva or Dave Eringa?

Manic Street Mania suggests - and this is the first time I've heard it - that it was the record company who actually turned Judge Yrself down for the Judge Dredd soundtrack. Can anyone corroborate this?

Lastly, Judge Yrself was included on THB 10th Anniversary DVD, which suggests to me that the band consider it to belong properly to THB era.

[gabo86]

Originally Posted by Automatik

If Door To The River and Midnight Sun were recorded during the KYE sessions and then unused, it raises another question of relevance when considering b-sides and 'exclusive tracks' - how many tracks recorded in each session are left unused?

It took over a decade for Midnight Sun to see the light of day, and nearly a decade for Judge Yrself (admittedly given different circumstances). Are there any other remnant songs from any era that we don't know about?

I think I read JDB mentioning that there nine (!) more unreleased songs from the RTF/Futurology sessions, which sounds far too many.

I remember Nicky saying, in an interview, that there is the "myth" of the unreleased songs, and that there aren't many unreleased songs. But he stated that before Midnight Sun was out, so if he hid it, he could hide everitying. Plus, he's not a reliable source about Manics, as we all know

[Adam Manic]

Thank you Gabo86 for this amazing list!!!

I've realised I have 151 out of the 154 from your list so I need to try and grab the remaining 3.

I've not heard or seen Kodawari, any ideas where I can find this? I don't see it on youtube! (whereas Anti Social Manifesto is)

Thanks