The quest to reclaim PFAYM

[Nature's Discontent]

Originally Posted by bachelorette

Seconded, there seems to be something very negative beyond mere sales that the band connects with Lifeblood.

You could say that the band all have a certain image that the 'Manic Street Preachers' need to fulfill, which the band (and the NME etc.) have constantly told us they returned to with SATT, after the 'fiasco' of Lifeblood. Also, there's the whole 'there are two sides to this band, the anthemic, poppy EMG-esque side and the visceral, angular THB-esque side' argument (which I agree - along with most people - is complete bollocks).

But I don't even see that that argument stands up anymore. RTF is such a unique, fresh-sounding record unlike anything they've ever done before, which fits its own niche and offers a further demonstration of what the band is capable of. If James, Sean and Nicky are all still rather cold towards Lifeblood then it's basically them just stubbornly sticking to their guns on how that record 'ruined the band' or 'didn't sound like the band'. They're just repeating what they've already said around the SATT/JFPL/PFAYM period, and despite RTF's release and its obvious departure from their commercial style, they're sticking to the 'party line' on Lifeblood. I don't think they genuinely think it's as bad a record as they claim it to be in the media, now they just seem to be reluctant to go back on their comments and say what they actually feel about it.

Course, I could be way off the mark with this one and they actually really do hate it with a passion

[Tom]

I watched that BBC Breakfast interview with them earlier and James was like 'yeah we made one bad album' and then went on to name Lifeblood.

I dunno, w/e. It were nearly 10 years ago now!

[hummingbird]

saying lifeblood is shit seems to be their shorthand. If pushed they'll say they like parts of it. They don't hate it, it just didn't turn out the way they wanted

[raven]

Originally Posted by tzb

So I've recently come back to the band for the first time since 2009 and the fantastic Journal For Plague Lovers. Rewind The Film is a really good record, not my favourite by them but the kind of thing I'm keen to hear from the band at this point in their lives, and to be honest it's nice to feel I've got "my band" back after the debacle that was the entire PFAYM project. Many people who stuck with them during that time or even liked the album can't understand why so many longstanding fans were put off the band at the time of PFAYM's release, so I thought I'd try and elucidate for anyone who might be genuinely interested. After that I'm putting together "my" version of PFAYM from all tracks of the era. Feel free to skip the rest, between the dashes!

---

I did read it all....even between the dashes and it was good to read....even if I didn't necessarily agree (surprise). I get the enthusiasm, I completely understand how they've been 'there' through so many things good and bad and start to feel like relatives (although there is truth in 'Don't put your life in the hands of a rock n roll band and throw it all away'). I'd noticed them with Generation Terrorists (borrowed that on cassette out the library), Gold....but (well, I was going through a erm metal phase) but it was The Holy Bible where I really noticed them - they published all the lyrics in the middle of Melody Maker, NME....as an advert for the album and looked everywhere for the damn thing on Bank Holiday Monday....it was also just what I needed at that time and did help me make a decision about erm stuff. They did seem a band that people got a wee bit obsessed with, especially around Richey not so much around the history, politics which me loved more the mutilation then he went for a wander and the intense fan base people gradually faded off

.....Everything Must Go never felt like an apology to fans as mentioned ..... they've never seemed that fussed about the fans, they've never felt like a band who felt restricted by the expectations of their core fans, or a need to keep a loyal fan base....and they've always wanted to sell lots of records and reach new audiences so all that appearing on Strictly....didn't seem to me un-Manic (albeit they looked awkward and should have donned their best ballroom frocks) they've never been awkward or elitist and to turn down shows like that would, to me, feel a bit snobbish, a bit up themselves. One last shot at mass communication....I do hear what you're saying but to me that was verymanics.....they've always wanted a large audience. I remember when Everything came out and old cultofRichey fans were disgusted that A design for Life became such a huge hit and they were at gigs with fans who were just out to enjoy that gig and weren't covered in boas and leopard prints and probably thought the song was about cars. But would you say Design for Life was a sell out? JFPL was never gonna be the bands direction without Richey. That was very much Richey's album. I don't personally feel it's fair to compare JFPL with any of the albums they've done. It felt like a very personal album, something they needed to do as a final tribute to Richey and maybe a hint of what the album after HB may have been like had Richey stayed. I don't think they could have continued on very long down that path

To me, Postcards was/is brilliant. Probably the one record of theirs since The Holy Bible that I've loved the most and felt like they'd found their voice, that Richey's shadow was there and always will be.....and that's not an entirely bad thing but Postcards felt like Nicky had gained the confidence he'd never quite had....maybe it's a personal thing....if many fans don't like it I don't understand but then for a band with such a dedicated fan base that's never been a place I fitted in neither....which is kinda also why I like them as a band - they've always felt like they couldn't care less what you think not through arrogance just cos they do their own thing, are insular and yet they were 'yours' and not really for sharing

They make you feel like it is OK to be curious, to want to learn. to appreciate solitude. And although everything gets analysed to the nth degree to see what it might be saying about Richey his lyrics about depression, eating disorders....were not all from the perspective of the big 'I' as selfish as depression can make a person he still kept a perspective in his lyrics and an ability to write from other viewpoints as in 4st 7lbs they wouldn't have struck a chord otherwise although again ultimately his disappearance shows he had no answers....or maybe he did in the end have a final answer. I don't know whether that perspective/clarity could have continued neither, I like parts of Journal but a lot of it is from one fucked up mind. I don't think depression and obsessive behaviours aid writing I think it often does the opposite and smothers a person.

Maybe Postcards was partly your time to take some time away from the family? Maybe that intensity can become too much. I have Rewind...but I've yet to listen to it (though that's mainly cos everything is literally upside down at the minute so haven't had time to have a clear thought in my head and I want to sit and listen properly.....but I couldn't have not listened all this time a few years back....still I know they're there when i need em

Ramble back at ya

[Mr Richey]

Stu, this is one of the most well written and brilliantly thought out posts ever to grace this forum. Thank you for sharing your thoughts, I really enjoyed reading them. And I'll go on record here as saying that "Broken Up Again", "Distractions" and "Lost Voices" are the best songs of the PFAYM era.

[Littlesue]

Originally Posted by hummingbird

saying lifeblood is shit seems to be their shorthand. If pushed they'll say they like parts of it. They don't hate it, it just didn't turn out the way they wanted

More like it did'nt sell the way they wanted.

[Smiling#Girl]

Originally Posted by Littlesue

More like it did'nt sell the way they wanted.

I'm just thinking about how Wire would describe Lifeblood if it would have sold a milion....

[beautifuldistortion]

Must say this thread is very interesting and one of the best for a while!
PFAYM to me was enjoyable...at first. I liked it at the time but I think that's mainly due to needing them in my life at the time.
However listening to it now, I am left rather unimpressed.
'Broken up again' 'Red Rubber' and 'I know the numbers' are far superior to all of the album tracks.
So really even though the album isn't really that great we have the luxury of a band who's B-sides are so stunning they can make any Manics period a great one!

Just wish they had a bit more clue about which tracks are better than others! Or maybe it's part of some sick plan of Wire's to wind us all up?!

[UEF]

Originally Posted by FacelessSenseOfVoid

To them I think that sales/chart positions mean more than how good a record actually is, which is very embarassing behaviour.

If you depended on sales for your income and keeping your house going you'd soon start to associate good feelings with big sellers and bad feelings with the Lifebloods, unfortunately.

[Nature's Discontent]

Originally Posted by beautifuldistortion

Just wish they had a bit more clue about which tracks are better than others! Or maybe it's part of some sick plan of Wire's to wind us all up?!

Were the latter b-sides for SKON and PFAYM recorded afterwards? If so, then for those I guess the pressure was off. Without the shadow of commercial ambition hanging over the creative process, the band sound freer and all the better for it.

[Mr Richey]

I think PFAYM and SATT were the most affected by Manics B-Side Syndrome.

[bachelorette]

Originally Posted by UEF

If you depended on sales for your income and keeping your house going you'd soon start to associate good feelings with big sellers and bad feelings with the Lifebloods, unfortunately.

With touring and saving loads by having their own studio, 90s record sales and a few slow burners in their back catalogue, do you really think they are back-to-the-wall financially? I mean, they are obviously not as rich as some, but I don't think they're suffering hardship, either.
I'd imagine that it's more about the fact that they seem to equate being relevant as band with (big) record sales. They seem to have a very narrow definition of "success" in that way.

[starstruck]

hearing the band apparently think they get, what 10 years late, some publicity mileage by saying "Lifeblood is shit" because it didn't sell well doesn't affect my love for the album at all. the same way Bowie saying he was "so coked he remembers none" of recording Station To Station has no bearing, and probably a dozen examples further of artists not liking what they have produced. you wish they wouldn't, but hey ho.

further, i do not object to artists being brazen about wanting sales and money. this is why they do what they do. when Scorsese was quizzed about the lack of awards in his career, he said "movies are not about awards, they are about money. you have to make money in order to be allowed to make another one".

to recap as brief as i can, LB had on it a solid gold, clear cut single, 1985, that they chose to ignore, opting instead to go with The Love Of Richard Nixon as a single. presumably so they could fuck around in masks for the video. they then make a lame gesture of editing the lyrics of Empty Souls, leaving me and i dare say a few others scratching their head, for the "dead flowers" line works loads better on the song than what they had anyway.

say the album is shit because of sales all you like, but it's you or whatever dickhead advises you that kneecapped the album with bizarre single decisions.

after SATT Nicky's erection for chart positions and sales clearly gained a few inches. fair enough, but that makes what happened next all the more baffling :

JFPL : no singles bar around half of it being full of potential top 20 songs. video made for one song that was hard work to find and watch around the world. make it pretty clear that the tour, playing the album in full, will be probably the only time the songs get heard live but don't record it.

PFAYM : decide on a song that sounds a bit like Your Love Alone for the lead single in the hope that it gets similar success. cool. do all the promo work, release the video and that 6 (six) weeks before the single is released. when the single is released, go in to hiding - no appearances, no interviews, nothing but silence. declare "the single is dead" when it does not sell well. throw the somewhat unfestive themed Some Kind Of Nothingness at the Christmas market instead of the nostalgic/winteryesque themed title track. be upset when it turns out Ian someone is mostly unknown across UK and doesn't sell well. eventually throw PFAYM out as a single but do all you can to express disdain for doing it.

they have a funny way of trying to get the big sales they crave. the songs that could draw a larger audience in were always there.

that said, i do hope RTF is a massive seller for them, it deserves to be.

[bachelorette]

Originally Posted by starstruck

PFAYM : decide on a song that sounds a bit like Your Love Alone for the lead single in the hope that it gets similar success. cool. do all the promo work, release the video and that 6 (six) weeks before the single is released. when the single is released, go in to hiding - no appearances, no interviews, nothing but silence. declare "the single is dead" when it does not sell well. throw the somewhat unfestive themed Some Kind Of Nothingness at the Christmas market instead of the nostalgic/winteryesque themed title track. be upset when it turns out Ian someone is mostly unknown across UK and doesn't sell well. eventually throw PFAYM out as a single but do all you can to express disdain for doing it.

they have a funny way of trying to get the big sales they crave. the songs that could draw a larger audience in were always there.

that said, i do hope RTF is a massive seller for them, it deserves to be.

This, every word of this!

[darkanddivine]

I shan't go so far as to explain in detail my fandom, but those who know me know that I have been on the long haul with MSP like many of us. I've also posted about why I think the band have issues with their self image, and some very odd problems with their own catalogue etc etc, but those debates are for another time. I've had my "break" and come back for some shows a few years, back but I still think the sense of history and inflated importance of certain elements of their qualities does leave MSP hamstrung in whatever they do.

The simple feeling I get, is that there has been a noticeable dip in songwriting quality in the last few years for whatever reason. The last 2 albums are not records that I really want to return to after a few listens. Usually with any MSP release, there is something in there that grips me and entices that extra time with the records. For whatever reason, that little sprinkling of magic dust appears to have eluded them. Now it's not unusual for them to make misteps, but when in the past they've failed to make a great album, there are always genuinely amazing tracks somewhere in the mix. Since JFPL nothing has had that almost sublime feel to it, with the exception of the odd moment here and there, but they are few and far between.

Not that any of this matters, there are many other bands who I have had the same feeling with at one stage or another.